I've been attending meetings for quite a while now, and there is always discussion ad nauseum about getting grass cut at abandoned houses. What a waste of time! I simply don't understand why meetings are filled with such items when they could easily be accomplished by calling a city employee on the phone. If you look at an Agenda for one of these meetings, you never see anything of substance. The only public hearings they have are for issues required by law.
For example, everyone knows the Board is considering bringing a casino to the Natchez Riverfront, but it has never been on their Agenda. The only reason it was discussed tonight is because three citizens (Gwen Ball, Neil Varnell, and I) asked for time to discuss it. My testimony was basically asking them to involve the citizens in their decisions about the use of city property. Gwen discussed some of the research on casinos. Neil urged them to abide by the Chadbourne plan for waterfront development. Mostly our testimony was met with stares, although I'm quite certain that Aldermen Massey was snearing at us and even made a snide remark under his breath. Gwen asked the Aldermen if they had a vision or a plan for the city. After a period of silence, Aldermen Middleton said his vision was for jobs. Perhaps the most telling moment was when Neil offered to go over the Chadbourne plan and asked if anyone was willing to do this. Only Middleton raised his hand. The rest were totally disinterested in learning about it, even though theoretically they're bound to abide by it - and I'd bet my last dollar none of them are knowledgeable about it. There has been speculation that Middleton is planning to run for Mayor, which may explain why he's being nice.
During the reports of the Aldermen, Aldermen Gray told us why he walked out of the meeting last time. He said that a city employee, without any authorization at all, negotiated with a developer for a casino and presented a contract to the Board. Aldermen Gray said he didn't want any more citizen lawsuits, and he knew that was not the legal way to do it, and he was having nothing to do with it. After the meeting, I asked him if the city employee was David Gardner, since someone had posted a comment on this blog to that effect. He said it was. Even the most boring meeting has its gems!
I think I forgot to tell you that, as a result of Aldermen Gray and Mathis walking out, the City has solicited bids on the development of Roth Hill. Bids are due in mid November.
UPDATE: The ad is in today's paper and says:
REQUESTS FOR PROPOSAL. Notice is hereby given that the City of Natchez, Mississippi is Requesting Proposals for the Lease or Purchase and Development of the Roth Hill Road Site until 5 pm on November 16 2006.
I also attended two other meetings that are never attended by the public, although by law they are open. One was the "Working Session" yesterday and the other was the Finance Committee today. In both cases, I was the only person there, although Joan Gandy from the Democrat came late to both. I don't know if I inhibited them or not, but they surely didn't do much of anything in either meeting. It was mostly chit chat about this and that, with no organization that I could ascertain.
In the meeting this afternoon, they voted to go into Executive Session after about 30 minutes, which meant Joan and I had to leave. There are legal reasons to go into Executive Session, but there's no way to tell what they talked about once we left. I can tell you they go into Executive Session a lot.
There is another "Working Session" next Wednesday at 4 pm, in case anyone is interested in joining me. This Wednesday (October 25) is the meeting of the Community Alliance at 3 pm in the Convention Center.
PS I will be letting you know of an organizational meeting in the near future.
PSS It would be helpful if Commenters would register a name before leaving a comment. When everyone uses Anonymous, it makes it difficult for us to respond to comments. Let me assure you that no one, including me, knows who you are when you register except Google.
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52 comments:
David Massey had been a very effective alderman and represented his constituents very well for many years. He would most likely be a shoe-in once again if he were to run for re-election tomorrow. What makes you think that the "vision" of a few people who choose to voice their opinion at a meeting should carry more weight than that of those who were elected to conduct the business of the city? Fact is, the last time the voice of "the citizens" was heard these leaders were elected by a majority to make certain decisions. How do you know that a majority of Massey's constituents are dissatified? Do you really think the majority of "the citizens" think like you?
Since when does it take three hours round trip to get to the Lorman campus of Alcorn? It was also noted on this blog that there is an advertisement for proposals for development of the vacant city owned land under-the-hill. Perhaps you and Vernell should submit your proposal to purchase the property and develop that entertainment district since it's such a brilliant idea. (In case you are not aware, the one bar under-the-hill has been involved in a legal battle for quite some time in attempt to remain in business). Citizens have the right to vote, but no right what so ever to be involved in every little decision made by the mayor and board.
It is true, Under the Hill Saloon went through years of legal battle with James Biglane who owns most of the land Under the Hill along Silver St. Others own the land around Roth Hill and Biglane may own some of it, I'm not certain. After years of the Saloon operating and being short of a tourist destination, James Biglane decided to move Under the Hill and is currently living above the gift shop. Since this time, he has tried to drive the Saloon out of business. First he closed all of the parking lots UTH. Then he constantly calls the police if there is a band and if the noise becomes too loud.
Also true is that most citizens don't have time to involve themselves in local politics and many of the same elected officials will most likely be re-elected. The officials see the people in the meetings as the elite; they do not see them as the majority. However, there have been issues where citizens did band together and did make a difference after much invested time and money and. It depends on the particular issue. Natchezians were offered a right to vote on the issue of casinos and they chose to allow them. So now you must define what particular issue you are fighting. Do you want to choose how many casinos can now be allowed? Do you want to change the first voting decision or have a new vote? Entertainment at Roth Hill, where are the investors for that? The Aldermen are simply reacting to proposals presented to them, which may only be those of casinos. good luck.
Question: Why is David Gardner allowed to do whatever he wants to do without any restraint from the mayor and board. The fact that he went out and got a contract signed for another casino is a good reason to terminate him immediately. He is pulling the wool over all of our eyes. He needs to go
He is still running Engineering and also over Water works. I can't answer the "authority" question but wouldn't believe any ONE person with the City would have that authority.
Why would anyone who is a city employee submit the proposal of a 3d party to the city for a project involving publicly owned property? Does Mr. Gardner have a vested interest in such a proposal? Are these people friends of his? Here is a guy who has engineered the trails project and is now pushing for casinos? I can't imagine this is in his job description. I truly believe there are some ethical questions which need to be entertained in this situation.
I am going to send a copy of this blog to the Attorney General's Office and the State Ethics Commission and see if they will investigate this matter.
Good! While they're at it (Atty. General's ofc.) they might find some other matters of interest.
I commend David Gardner for trying to push forward and get something done. Natchez needs movement and action.
Anonymous said...
Good! While they're at it (Atty. General's ofc.) they might find some other matters of interest.
They won't do anything, look at the Zion Church Parking lot overlay.
The City began leasing this parking lot and Bubba West was having a hissy fit to get it overlayed, It was never approved by the Board and then City Attorney Walter Brown told them not to do it because it was possibly illegal, but Bubba insisted.
So he ordered the Public Works Director to do it.
Well the calls flooded the State Auditor's office when work started, and an investigation was started.
Bubba denied giving the order to the PWD, but the PWD had him on tape giving the order. Ya gotta love it.
Anyway, they said "technically it was not an overlay" Yeah Right!
What about conflict of interest, or just plain ethics?
Political ethics, theres a contradiction in terms.
But let me state that I'm certain David Gardner was acting on the request of Board Member/s not on his own.
I have to agree with the previous poster saying I don't believe David was acting on his own either. He's done a done of good work for the City and I don't believe he would put himself out on a limb.
You guys outta ask about the job the Police and Fire Chiefs have done to run their departments in the ground.
You may be right, "anonymous", about D. Gardner being put up to this by the boa. Nothing about them surprises me. Why would the city council encourage him to do so? Why not just advertise for bids? Did they think they could escape the law again, as they did in the condo deal? I sometimes think they try real hard to be "above the law", thumb their noses at those who are watching them. Maybe they have something going with somebody, somewhere, that they think they'll get by with this. But, from what I understand this kind of thing has been going on for a long, long time and they are outraged that anyone, citizens, would question them. But, if Gardner is beyond reproach in his regard for legal ethics he would know to decline...but then he has a job which could be sacrificed for integrity.
Regardless of who it is..., David Gardner, Ronnie Ivey, or whoever. you know it is wrong you should have balls to stand up and say, "NO, I AM NOT GOING TO DO IT!" Let the chips fall as they may. If you do wrong, you are guilty. David and Ronnie both knew what they did was wrong. Just like they knew it was illegal to instruct the public works crew to dump that stuff in the St. Catherine Creek. The employees of the Public Works Department have said that they were told to do it. David and Ronnie planned to dump it and cover it up, but it rained and their game plan was busted. These two guys are not above the law. There actions are not above reproach. If they are wrong, they are just wrong.
WE SHOULD NOT UPHOLD ELECTED OR APPOINTED OFFICIALS WHEN THEY ARE WRONG...., NO MATTER WHO THEY ARE, BLACK OR WHITE.
WRONG IS WRONG AND THEY WERE WRONG AND THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN FIRED FOR WHAT THEY DID.
Mark my words: THE CITY WILL BE SORRY THAT THEY DID NOT FIRE THEM.
Zion Chapel Church is where Alderman West attends. He had them to pave the parking lot as a favor to him so that he would look good at this church. It was wrong and he should have been penalized for it. Perhaps Neil, Gwen and Paris should have filed a law suit against the city for that.
Anonymous said...
"Regardless of who it is..., David Gardner, Ronnie Ivey, or whoever. you know it is wrong you should have balls to stand up and say, "NO, I AM NOT GOING TO DO IT!" Let the chips fall as they may. If you do wrong, you are guilty. David and Ronnie both knew what they did was wrong. Just like they knew it was illegal to instruct the public works crew to dump that stuff in the St. Catherine Creek. The employees of the Public Works Department have said that they were told to do it. David and Ronnie planned to dump it and cover it up, but it rained and their game plan was busted. These two guys are not above the law. There actions are not above reproach. If they are wrong, they are just wrong.
WE SHOULD NOT UPHOLD ELECTED OR APPOINTED OFFICIALS WHEN THEY ARE WRONG...., NO MATTER WHO THEY ARE, BLACK OR WHITE.
WRONG IS WRONG AND THEY WERE WRONG AND THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN FIRED FOR WHAT THEY DID.
Mark my words: THE CITY WILL BE SORRY THAT THEY DID NOT FIRE THEM."
It must be easy for you to as an armchair employee to make this statement, but when your job is on the line in this town you generally follow orders, because there are not a lot of alternatives.
The BOA could not fire you for an refusing to do something illegal, but all City employees with the exception of Police and Fire (civil service), serve at the will and pleasure of the board so one could be dismissed on the whim of the BOA.
I bet you would review your ethics if put in the same situation!
Wow..., sounds like the truth is hurting somone. These responses are VERY INTERESTING.
This has indeed gotten interesting, but let me ask two questions;
1. How many of you actually go to the BOA meetings?
From reading this, it appears that there are many citizens with opinions and ideas on how to run the City, The ethics police,along with rumors of misconduct and affairs, (imagine that, rumors in Natchez), and talk of throwing the local politicians and public officials out, Jackie Collins is taking notes from these pages.
This is Natchez at it's best, a lot of talk but no action.
2. Will any of you run for office in the next election?
I'm with the guy who wants to get rid of the "Smut Mongers"! Here Here!
That's the best post I've ever read on this board. Is there a way to get that one moved to the front page?
I also like the post about alot of talk and no action. Now there's some truth coming out.
Let's start discussion on how to run the "smut mongers", trouble makers and those who are against progress out of town.
HERE IS MY RESPONSE TO ALL OF THE STUFF THAT IS HAPPENING IN THE CITY I LOVE DEARLY:
2 Chronicles 7:14
14 If my people, who are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
Faith without action is dead. Natchez needs leadership, growth, industry, casinos, condominiums, smoke stacks, education, and anything else that is willing to invest or provide jobs. Can you say hello fayette?
Why is it that when people express the truth and begin to expose things that are not right, they are "labeled" as trouble makers?
Wow--whoever these anonymous posters are--if you are going to talk smack about someone, then you should at least have the guts to identify yourself. Hiding behind your anonymity and taking pot-shots at the personal character of others (i.e. Mr. Gardiner's personal life) is about as chickenshit as it comes. I doubt anyone posting here, including myself, hasn't made a mistake at some point that has caused pain and embarassment to others. I happen to think Mr. Gardiner is damn good at his job. Whether or not others agree, Mr. Gardiner should be judged only on the merits of his job performance. His personal life should not be fodder for the nasty little back-biters on this blog. Shame on you.
Bravo Tom Scarborough. You just beat me to it. The nasty and unnecessary comments made about David Gardner on this blog can be summed up in one word: HATEFUL.
I'm proud to sign my name to this entry and I hope others will speak out as well.
Blogmaster - I know you remove comments that use profanity. I think the horrific comment about Gardner's personal life is about as profane an action as anything I've ever seen. The least that can be done about this is to remove the comment from the blog.
Thanks.
AMEN to that Tom!
Another thank you to Mr. Scarborough. I will remain anonymous but I must say having attended many city council meetings, and often not in agreement with what goes on there, I would never hide behind my anonymity here or anywhere and smear someone's character with dubious details of his/her personal life. I would like to think that we can leave the "personal details" out of these discussions. It is a wonderful opportunity to express ourselves anonymously and that privilege requires a responsibility to truth and integrity...even under the cover of anonymity.
All posters to this site should be extremely careful about your comments. While we may think that we know a person, unless we are with them all of the time, we really cannot say that we know them. Yes, we all make mistakes. However, we must all be willing to accept the responsibility for our mistakes. We should not live our lives expecting someone to always bail us out when we are wrong.
I know David Gardner quite well and I also know that some of the postings by the "anonymous" person are true.
I hate that this blog has become what it has, but it is definitely putting out the information on everyone.
Thanks Casey.
I'm all for discussing issues that fall within the purview of the public good--and a free pass for a drunken driving incident certainly merits responsible investigation. But an individual's marital life does not meet that test, in my opinion. Nor does dragging the name and reputation of other city employees through the mud. Mr. Oglethorpe, if you really think it is okay to disseminate sleazy innuendo about others within the cyber-Natchez community, then your ethical compass is badly in need of recalibration.
May I also suggest you be a bit more circumspect about labeling people "Nazis". That's a pretty loaded term to be tossing around indiscriminately.
Tom Scarborough
Many people here in Natchez are more concerned with getting their version of the story out rather than getting the facts and here is another example of it.
David was arrested for DUI while in his personal vehicle not a City Vehicle and booked at the NPD.
As I recall, the story was printed in the Natchez Democrat.
To my knowledge he was subsequently prosecuted but to what extent, I cannot say, because I never ask him.
Unless there is another incident I am unaware of, this appears to be more fodder from the "elite rumor morons" which have no interest in the facts.
"I hate that this blog has become what it has, but it is definitely putting out the information on everyone."
I bet you would have a different view if you were the target of such information!
By the way, the word information in your sentence should be replaced with GOSSIP.
I believe that this blog was intended as a place to discuss issues concerning the future of Natchez, not old idle gossip.
Regards
And you are? A saint, that is.
I am so thrilled to know that God has seen fit to place a saint like you in Natchez.
Sign your name. We could all benefit from knowing the true identity of this local saint.
Imagine the boost to local tourism if we can prove that Natchez has a living Saint! Maybe we can become a shrine.
Show yourself Saint! Natchez needs you! We'll put your face on a billboard. People will come from around the world to touch your robe.
Any comments that include rumors about anyone's personal behavior will be deleted. If these comments continue, I will have to take further steps, which will unfortunately result in less freedom on this blog for everyone else. So whoever you are, please cease and desist.
Thank you, Casey Ann. I, for one, like that policy.
Thank goodness!!!!
I've already been telling people to avoid the blog but now I can tell them
'THE BLOG IS ON!!!!"
THANKS CASEY! WHAT A RELIEF.
Natchezians are so interesting. There are some things about this place I will never understand. Question: Can we ALL get along?
DietLysol: You are mistaken. My ability to control content is more than adequate. Unfortunately, such controls will limit the freedom of others.
Since you seem to know so much about blogs, I suggest you start one of your own where you may post whatever rumors or gossip that you wish. That is not the purpose of this blog, and I intend to strictly enforce this.
You're right, Benny Boy--no percentage in trying to reason with small-minded and mean-spirited little gerbils like you.
That is all.
The previous post is mine, Benny. Just wanted to make certain you were clear on that.
To DietLysol:
This time you're right. The only thing I'm forbiding is "personal stuff". But you're wrong about control - my goal is not to have to control this blog at all. If people will voluntarily leave out the "personal stuff", then we can continue to have a free flowing stream of opinions. The purpose of the blog IS to provide "power to the people".
Duly noted, Casey. Apologies to Mr. Oglethorpe.
I am interested in knowing your thoughts on the City's plan to pay for a position for the NAPAC museum. Do you think they should do it? If yes, why? If no, why?
QUESTION: How is providing funding for this position any different from putting money into the Downtown Development Association budget?
How do you all feel about the City providing money to the NAPAC museum to fund a director position?
DietLysol said...
I believe it would be a good idea to have that museum and director. I'm a white dude, but it does seem that Natchez needs a little more balance when it comes to projects that are race specific.
Could you tell us what "projects" we have now that are "race specific"?
They cannot even afford to hire a City Planner! How in the HELL could they possibly consider hiring a director for some non-city related association?
I really don't understand how the City keeps doing such stupid stuff. I think someone should get an attorney general's opinion on this matter. I tried to search their opinion page but the server was down. Only elected or duly appointed government officials can request an official opinion according to the AG's office website.
I would seem as though they would look at the museum's productivity, current marketing strategy, fundraising plan, budget, past audits or compilations of expenditures, etc. before deciding to "donate" taxpayer's monies.
I AM NOT against supporting the museum, but even the old "welfare" system has been overhauled. We should not support or invest taxpayer's money in an organization that is not trying to do something for itself.
I never hear anything or see anything in print about NAPAC. They do not seem to have the leadership in place that has the skills and abilities to do anything other than open the museum on a part-time basis; hold the annual student luncheon; have a fashion show; and, that's it.
I know that "thinking out of the box" is a term that has been driven in the ground for quite sometime now, but the museum has a great potential.
I wonder if the fact that the current president of the NAPAC board, Rev. Leroy White, is Mayor
West's best buddy has anything to do with this request and push for approval.
I eagerly await the continued discussion.
Did anyone hear that the mayor was under an FBI investigation for a HUD grant that the City received?
A grant was given to the City to prepare a community development master plan. The mayor has been secretly trying to manipulate to purpose of the grant. He wanted to use it for recreational stuff, but the grant purpose was outlined by HUD.
The grant was funded through a congressional appropriation to HUD for the HUD Economic Development Initiative (EDI). I just read where he wants to use it to pay for a website.
This is going to bite the city in the butt......
Anonymous, are you sure the HUD grant for planning disallows use of funds for a website? And if so, does the Mayor know this already?
A grant was given to the City to prepare a community development master plan. This was mentioned in one of the board meetings.
Is a "WEBSITE" a community development plan?
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